Ruby award winner Madeline Ash

This is Episode 8 of Write with Love and with Valentines Day coming up this week. I’d like to introduce you to 2017 Ruby award winner, Madeline Ash. Self-confessed introvert, Madeline writes sensitive, sexy contemporary romance.

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Transcript:

Sarah Williams:            Today I’m talking to 2017 RUBY award-winner, Madeline Ash. Thanks for your time today, Madeline.

Madeline Ash:              Thanks, Sarah, it’s really exciting to be here.

Sarah Williams:            You write sensitive, sexy, contemporary romance.

Madeline Ash:              Yeah.

Sarah Williams:            Can you tell us about your journey to publication, please?

Madeline Ash:              Okay. Well, it’s been a bit of a long one, or it’s felt that way. Way back and uni I was studying professional writing, and the end of first year, we had a Mills & Boon romance author come in for a guest lecture. To date, we had learned non-fiction writing and short story fiction writing, but nothing about genre fiction. It was really engaging, and she was so passionate about the Mills & Boon category length, that I was just really intrigued, and I thought, “What a great way to learn story structure.” Because, at that point, I still had this vision of writing fantasy sagas. 200,000 word stories, and I had no idea how to start that.

Madeline Ash:              I thought what a much more digestible format, and word limit. I could start with a 50,000 word Mills & Boon novel, ’cause it sounded like so much fun, to learn how to create characters and how to plot, and all of the story basics that I would need to learn.

Madeline Ash:              I started writing my first Mills & Boon that year, and submitted it and got rejected. I was like, “Ah, I’d better try again.” And, then, I kept going, and after a few years I realized it wasn’t easy, just because it was shorter, there’s a lot to unpack, and a lot to learn in that length. Then, I was like, “That’s it, I’m gonna do this.” And I was hooked on romance, by that point. It had been a few years, so I joined Romance Writers of Australia, and I got a critique group, and I started doing online courses, and attending the conference, and sort of emerged myself in all of this information on how to write romance fully and completely.

Madeline Ash:              From some of that first lecture, six years on from that, I had written 12 manuscripts, ’cause I was working away at it, trying to not fizz out. I had every single one of those rejected by Mills & Boon in that time, as happened. But, by 2012 I had a full request, my first full manuscript request, which was then ultimately rejected, ’cause apparently it was too tragic.

Madeline Ash:              But, I disagreed with that, I’m like, “No, this is a really exciting story, and it’s not tragic, it’s got a lot of hope.” Then, I submitted that to Destiny Romance, which was Penguin Australia’s imprint at the time. And, within five days, they had accepted that for publication.

Sarah Williams:            Oh, wow.

Madeline Ash:              That was really exciting, and then following that, I had another two accepted by Destiny in a couple of years after that. And, then, I decided it would be really nice to try the American readership and the American market, and sort of expand a bit. ‘Cause I don’t write rural Australian books that are specifically tailored to the Australian market, or that specifically appeal to the Australian market. I was just wanting to expand that. I approached Tule Publishing, and then worked with Kelly Hunter, and have had four books out with Tule in the past couple of years, which has been really exciting and sort of opened me up to submitting to the RITA awards, and getting a little bit more of a readership over there, which has been really exciting.

Madeline Ash:              And, then, I also had my rights back on my three Destiny titles, so now I’ve consolidated into a core four books with Tule, and now am looking forward from there.

Sarah Williams:            Excellent. [crosstalk 00:04:03] That’s it.

Madeline Ash:              [crosstalk 00:04:06] for a bit there. But, yeah.

Sarah Williams:            Do you find your going with Tule has opened up the American market? You’ve got a much bigger readership now.

Madeline Ash:              I think I’m getting there, I still would like a larger readership. I still feel like I’m on the way towards where I want to be. But, I do think that it has helped. It’s just [inaudible 00:04:27] a bit, and opened up new settings for me, as well, and new story types and the troupes that really appeal to the American market, and things like that, which has been really good to learn.

Sarah Williams:            That’s it. And, obviously, the American market is so much bigger than the Australian market. That’s fantastic. Do you have a big social media presence? You’re on Twitter …

Madeline Ash:              I’m on Twitter, and I’m on Facebook, but I wouldn’t say I have a huge presence. I’m not very good at prioritizing that. I can get sucked down the rabbit hole a bit too quickly, I actually tend to avoid it. I’m a little hands-off. I’ve got my Twitter and my Facebook, but I don’t update probably as often as I should. I sort of go, “Oh, no. It’s writing time, I definitely just have to write. I shouldn’t jump on Facebook or jump on Twitter.”

Madeline Ash:              That’s something I need to learn a nice, happy medium, but I haven’t learned it, yet.

Sarah Williams:            That’s it. That’s brilliant. Excellent. Tell us about your RITA finalist and RUBY winning book, Breaking Good.

Madeline Ash:              I loved writing Breaking Good. How do I sum it up? It’s basically a bad boy hero, who is desperate to be good enough for a courageous heroine. It’s category-length, it’s a secret baby troupe, except the secret baby is eight years old. It takes place not immediately, but eight years after the prologue.

Madeline Ash:              I really enjoyed exploring the hero in that book, in particular, ’cause he has adult ADHD. And, I found that a really interesting conflict, internal, to work with, because he felt like, and I researched this in great detail, went on a lot of forums where adults with ADHD were sharing about their experience and how they cope with life that’s built around a normal head space.

Madeline Ash:              It sort of impacted the way he viewed potential fatherhood, and how he would be a father with this surprise baby, and also dealing with his internal conflict of that, which I found really fascinating. But, it ends well, as it does for so many people, but that initial conflict there where he didn’t think he would be able to cope with that was really engaging and fun for me to explore, and I think that that resonated with readers, as well.

Sarah Williams:            Yeah, that sounds brilliant. I love when research takes you out of what you’re expecting it to be, and you learn something new.

Madeline Ash:              Indeed, yes.

Sarah Williams:            Yeah. That is fantastic. Entering competitions, how long have you been entering competitions, and how do you think this has helped your writing?

Madeline Ash:              Well, I first started entering competitions pre-publication, so back when I was aspiring and learning to write, I would enter the first five pages, which I think is called ripping start now, and the First Kiss contest, and the ones that were available for aspiring writers.

Madeline Ash:              They were fantastic. They were really good in terms of getting feedback on my writing, which I was getting from my critique group, but it’s nice to get it from some other people, as well, to expand the feedback network. That was really valuable, I would get some great constructive criticism through that, and I was able to implement that, and see how that was really valuable.

Madeline Ash:              But, I guess it also gave me a structure, because I wasn’t published yet. I didn’t have deadlines. Didn’t have an editor telling me what to do, so the contests every year was something to aim for, and a good goal to write towards that deadline, and that submission date.

Madeline Ash:              The third thing was, also, the practice of forming a submission. You would have to figure out the synopsis to go with the first kiss, the summary, getting the characters into that situation so that it made more sense to the judges, and that was really good practice, as well. ‘Cause it basically is a submission, even though it’s not going to an editor or an agent, it’s going to the contest, but it’s really good practice at that, as well.

Madeline Ash:              Pre-publication, the contests were just really good in terms of the practice and the feedback. And, then, once I was published, there’s the RUBY and then the RITA, as well. And, they’ve been really exciting to enter. The fun was why I originally did it, because once you read the level where you’re published, you already submit to editors, and you have your own deadlines, so you don’t need that anymore, necessarily. It was more, you had your book edited, you’ve had it published, you’ve had it read, you get this one last push for this book, it’s one last thing that you can do with it for the year, is to submit it in the contest. And, then, you can really be like, “Okay. Bye. I’m finished with that book now, that’s the last thing.”

Madeline Ash:              It’s sort of fun, and sort of final farewell to submit it in the contest, is how I view that.

Madeline Ash:              To have been a finalist, to be lucky enough for that, to have a few of my books in the RITA, and the RUBY has just been really exciting and a huge bonus to have that follow. That final farewell, and the book comes back to me, and then there’s some more promo I can do with that, and get confidence from that. Feels like I’m doing something right to get that feedback, which is really, really exciting.

Sarah Williams:            Yeah, absolutely. Did you go over to America to be there, just in case you won?

Madeline Ash:              I did last year.

Sarah Williams:            Yeah.

Madeline Ash:              For Her Secret Prince, but I didn’t make it this year. I was like, “Two years in a row is just a little bit too much anxiety for me to fly over.” I’m not very good like that. Yeah, I did the first time, so that was really exciting, being there at the reader awards it’s just so many people in the room, everyone dressed up really glamorous, and it was overwhelmingly exciting. It was really good to get to be there that time, definitely.

Madeline Ash:              They live streamed it this year.

Sarah Williams:            They did?

Madeline Ash:              Yeah, which is really good to work. I still felt like I was there, kind of.

Sarah Williams:            Yeah. At the conference last year, did you pick up anything that you hadn’t known before, or meet anyone that you were fangirled a bit about?

Madeline Ash:              Well, I went to a Nora Roberts Q&A session. I didn’t ask any questions, I was too overwhelmed by her being there, but basically I was just excited. I was about 20 meters away from her, so that was the height of fangirling. But, there was just so much going on, I was actually very overwhelmed by it. I would like to go, again, to have my head in the space, and actually learn more. But, there was just 10 sessions running concurrently across two levels, and 2,000 people, and it was just huge. I guess the main takeaway was just the sheer volume of romance, and romance writers, and the quality that’s there.

Madeline Ash:              It’s just this amazing resource, Romance Writers of Australia, and Romance Writers of America. It’s just so special to have that there that we can attend, and we can all be a part of that, was the main takeaway, just being like, “Romance readers and romance writers are amazing.”

Sarah Williams:            They are.

Madeline Ash:              The vibe that’s there is this really powerful source. It was just nice to soak up on the vibes, as well.

Sarah Williams:            Yeah. I think that’s something important. Before I even started writing romance, I didn’t even know it was a genre.

Madeline Ash:              Oh, wow.

Sarah Williams:            Yeah. Then, I thought it was just Mills & Boon. And, you know, we have a certain preconception of what Mills & Boon is, especially if our parents read it. Then you start doing things, like Romance Writers of Australia and Romance Writers of America, and you go, “Wow, this is huge.” And, it really is one of the biggest markets.

Madeline Ash:              It is the biggest selling genre. It’s amazing. Yeah.

Sarah Williams:            Yeah. And everyone I’ve met, being mostly Australian or New Zealander, at this rate, has just been so supportive, and so absolutely amazing, and willing to give their time and their knowledge. I just think it’s an absolutely fantastic group, and you’re obviously saying the same sort of thing.

Madeline Ash:              Oh, the support is just unbelievable. Absolutely. Everyone is willing to help, everyone wants to recommend something else that you can do to get off the ground. Or, if I’m like, “Oh, I’m really struggling with this.” It’s like, “Oh, read this book. Or, get in touch with her, she’s really good with that.” And, the constant mentoring and support is just unbelievable. I think we’re so lucky to have this genre, and this association, and all the people willing to help. It’s so nice.

Madeline Ash:              It’s a family, it’s such a good family.

Sarah Williams:            It is. It’s our tribe.

Madeline Ash:              [inaudible 00:13:25]

Sarah Williams:            I’m very active on the Facebook sites. I’m on the emerging Facebook group, as well as the community group of Romance Writers of Australia. Yeah, anytime I’ve got a question, you put it up, and within five minutes, you’ve got the answer. Someone’s told ya.

Madeline Ash:              Yeah.

Sarah Williams:            And, then they’ve got the loops, as well.

Madeline Ash:              Yeah.

Sarah Williams:            That’s brilliant. And, you were at the Brisbane conference this year?

Madeline Ash:              Yes.

Sarah Williams:            Yes.

Madeline Ash:              Yes. Oh, such nice weather compared to Melbourne.

Sarah Williams:            Yeah, I live in North Queensland, so it’s like cold for me.

Madeline Ash:              Oh.

Sarah Williams:            So, you actually won the award this year. That was brilliant to watch you go up and get that.

Madeline Ash:              Oh, I was so nervous. It was very exciting, though. I think I dropped my pins and my certificates too many times. I was just a fumbling mess, ’cause I was so thrilled. Yeah, it was very exciting.

Sarah Williams:            Congratulations, I really want to say that. And, now I can.

Madeline Ash:              Thank you.

Sarah Williams:            I’ve bought the book, and I’m about halfway through it, and I’m loving it. So, well done.

Madeline Ash:              Thanks, Sarah.

Sarah Williams:            Excellent. So, tell us about juggling a career, because you write these novels, and then you also work part-time. And, you work as a business writer. So, tell us how you juggle that, and how you have the creative to be able to do both.

Madeline Ash:              Well, I suppose they’re like two different hats, ’cause the business is all non-fiction. It doesn’t require … Well, it requires creativity, but sort of in a different way. I’m not making stuff up. I’m just making stuff that exists sound really good.

Madeline Ash:              I guess, I’m lucky that I work three days a week in the business writing, and I get to write two days for my romance novels. I have those set days a week, so I can really focus on Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday. I don’t think about romance too much, I just let it sit at the back of my mind, sort of ticking over.

Madeline Ash:              I can not have to think about that, and then when I get to Thursday, Friday, I can then, on the reverse, block out the professional stuff and just focus, sink into my fiction.

Madeline Ash:              I find that divide really helpful for me, whereas I know some people working full-time who, then, also write romance. I don’t know how they do it. Just finding the time to do that, and switching gears within the same day must be really difficult. I find myself really lucky in that. Maybe not the best person to ask.

Madeline Ash:              [inaudible 00:15:53] on the higher level. But, yeah, I can’t remember. I’ve deviated from the question too much to remember what I was talking about.

Sarah Williams:            That’s okay. On your writing days, is it sit at your desk by 9:00 in the morning?

Madeline Ash:              Yeah. Yes.

Sarah Williams:            Thumb on the seat until 5:00, or something like that?

Madeline Ash:              Yeah. I really do try to do that. I’ve viewed it as a job, even while I was still aspiring. The days I would have off uni, or something like that, I was like, “That’s it. That’s what I’m doing today. It’s my job.” So, I would sit down and stick with it the whole day, just getting up for lunch or an exercise break if I was getting too restless sitting there.

Madeline Ash:              I really treat it, “I’m the boss, and I’m not letting myself get out of the chair until I’ve finished my word count.” Sometimes that might mean I write ’til 5:00, then go cook dinner and have it, but I still have to sit down for the next 500 words before I reach that word count for the day. And, I find it really helpful to view it like that, and just to have the discipline to sit there and get it done. But, that’s for me and the way I work.

Madeline Ash:              There are a lot of people who write a lot faster than I do, as well, so just having set time they can fly in and get in the zone and crank it out, whereas I spend my two days a week, and I usually reach maybe two and a half thousand works in total across those two days. I’m just particularly slow, but we get there in the end.

Sarah Williams:            Slow and steady, that’s excellent.

Madeline Ash:              That’s right.

Sarah Williams:            Tell us, is there ever any doubt, now that you’ve got these awards, is ever any self-doubt, and how do you conquer that?

Madeline Ash:              So much. So much self-doubt. A good example of that, I suppose, is just this year at the Brisbane conference, when I won the RUBY. I was really excited, and then I thought about it overnight. The book that I was currently on, for Tule, I had a mid-October deadline, which is now. It was gonna be my shortest turnaround. I was like, “I can do it, it’s good practice. I can do it, I just have to really concentrate and get it done.”

Madeline Ash:              And, then, I said to Megan, from Tule, who was there the next day, I said, “I’m kind of freaking out. I don’t think I can do it, because of this RUBY finalist, I felt like it put the pressure on even more. And, if someone who hadn’t read any of my books, try the Madeline Ash brand, with this next one coming out, and it’s not as good because I won’t have spent as much time on it. It’s gonna be terrible, and they’re gonna think, ‘Why did she win this award? She’s rubbish.'” I just had all this doubt that I couldn’t do it, even though I’m sure I would have been able to do it in that turnaround, I just would have really had to stick with it. But, I had this moment where I’m just like, “I can’t. I can’t do it. I can’t.”

Madeline Ash:              So, she’s like, “That’s okay. Take as long as you need.” She just alleviated the doubt by just giving me more time, which was really good. I think part of that was just wrapped up in just doubt of, “I don’t think I could ever write a good book again. I’ve done it once, and that’s it for me.”

Madeline Ash:              Definitely still get the doubt, and it just adds pressure from a different angle, ’cause we have pressure from all angles, no matter where we are, we’ll always feel it in some way. That was just, that was it.

Sarah Williams:            Yes, we don’t need to pressure ourselves.

Madeline Ash:              Yeah, that’s right.

Sarah Williams:            There’s so much pressure on our lives, as it is, just being women in today’s world. That’s excellent. Where can we find you online, Madeline, if people want to buy your books and talk to you some more?

Madeline Ash:              Well, I have a website, madelineash.net, which I update not all the time, but I do have a blog there that I try and get to. I am on Twitter and Facebook, so I’m Madeline Ash on Twitter, I think Madeline_Ash, and Madeline Ash Author on Facebook. I’m on Instagram, as well, as Madeline Ash Author.

Madeline Ash:              I do check those accounts every day, but I’m just not totally active on them. So, if you get in touch with me there, or follow or something, then I’ll be able to interact with you there, as well, which will be really good.

Sarah Williams:            Yes.

Madeline Ash:              And, email, the website has a contact form, so it’s nice to hear from readers, as well, if you want to get in touch that way, and I’ll email back. And, yeah, have a fun conversation, which is good, too.

Sarah Williams:            That’s fantastic. Well, thank you so much for chatting to me today, and all of us, for the future. I’m looking forward to some new books.

Madeline Ash:              Oh, thank you, it has been really fun, Sarah. Thanks for having me on.

Sarah Williams:            Brilliant, thank you.

Madeline Ash:              Okay.